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GenerationMP3 reviews the Gigabeat X30 *and* the Zen Vision:M
comment: 1 | Thursday, December 15 (2005) 06:44PM | Posted by Robert Sinke
Oh! Nice score by our French buddies over at GenerationMP3 - not only did they manage to get a hold of the new Creative DAP - the Zen Vision:M - but there's also a rather lengthy review on the latest Toshiba trick-up-the-sleeve: the X30.

As for the Zen Vision:M, here are the pros and cons:

The Creative is a very, very nice device - not only did Creative manage to give that much-needed "final touch" to an already-complete player, but they also succeeded in making it better than the iPod v5 (which doesn't make a good reference DAP on certain points, whereas on other areas the two are easily comparable). The Zen Vision:M is the top pick in its own league.

Pros: Efficient exterior design, sturdy touch pad, nice screen (bright, high-definition), better than the iPod v5

Cons: only compatible with Windows XP (MTP), software required to upload tracks and such

LINK



The GigaBeat X30 also got its own list of "cool" and "uncool" things to keep track of:

Pros:
+ Solid build quality
+ Reasonable price
+ Sound quality
+ Magnificent, large screen
+ Size (design)
+ Thickness (or lack thereof, design)
+ Gigabeat Room
+ Looks
+ Bundled earphones are of good quality
+ You can pimp this thing like there's no tomorrow
+ Easily-adjustable screen
+ FW-upgradable (hardly a pro, now is it, these days?)
+ Huge number of EQ settings (33 presets!)
+ Battery life better than proclaimed

Cons::
- No video support (yet?)
- Line-in ripping in WMA format
- No Ogg Vorbis support
- No gapless playback (sorry seb)
- No UMS compliance
- USB-Host on docking station only (I think)
- No remote control comes standard, no screen on the optional one
- No radio
- No MAC or Linux support
- Not available in France (or Holland, belgium, USA, Greenland etc)
- Non-user-replaceable battery

LINK (French)

Thanks, Greg
Comments

Michael
Location: New York City
Comments: 2802
Dec 15 (2005) 06:55PM  

I love the designs of both these players. It is too bad the X30 lacks video support, it'd look so nice on that screen. I lovee the vision:m. It has so many cool things about it.



Michael
Location: New York City
Comments: 2802
Dec 15 (2005) 06:58PM  

The Video converting software looks pretty simple and straightforward.



Skymaster

Comments: 64
Dec 15 (2005) 07:02PM  

We can add this review along with the cnet and register reviews. The Zen really has been getting good reviews from everywhere so far.

I must have the Zen Vision M.....



Michael
Location: New York City
Comments: 2802
Dec 15 (2005) 07:06PM  

I might just get it myself



ilh

Comments: 168
Dec 15 (2005) 07:12PM  

Awww. The 2 players that have been tugging at me.
Love my GB F20, you might say it lacks a lot, but it's a bloody great player, especially for use when driving - velcro the dock to dashboard and viola The cross and the UI are perfect for it. Kinda suprised Room is a pro though, usually people slate it (although i've had no problems with it), must've really improved it with v3.0. Sure linein ripping on the F20 was mp3 (not used it so can't remember), can't see why they'd change it
I was going to get the X30, but now the V:M is just about out so i'm getting that instead, just hope the touch strip L/R rockers aren't to hard to use on the drive or needed at all.



Skymaster

Comments: 64
Dec 15 (2005) 07:16PM  

But even with all these professional reviews, the ipod fanboys will continue to talk about how much better the ipod's screen is and that the creative is "over-saturated". Even thought the creative has 4 times the colors that the ipod has, the ipod has "truer color".



Cassiopeia

Comments: 188
Dec 15 (2005) 07:42PM  

I also do like new Toshiba x series, if it does support video playback and availlable worldwide with competitive price, it could sell well IMO.



Blakeypoo

Comments: 10
Dec 15 (2005) 07:58PM  

Anyone know how I can view this review in English. I've tried translators, but some words are switched.



3284lmm
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Comments: 358
Dec 15 (2005) 08:02PM  

google toolbar on IE, click right< translate



sashimi

Comments: 18
Dec 15 (2005) 08:16PM  

why the depedency on Win XP ? does it have to do with windows DRM ?



3284lmm
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Comments: 358
Dec 15 (2005) 08:19PM  

must... resist... impulse... buy, noo!!! I think i'll probably consider buying the vision:m, it all depends on when i get my legal copy of windows xp.... I couldn't understand what they concluded about the audio quality of this device. All i could make out was that the X5 destroyed the ipod as far as SQ



painkiller

Comments: 109
Dec 15 (2005) 08:37PM  

I just gotta buy this for Christmas...



Michael
Location: New York City
Comments: 2802
Dec 15 (2005) 08:50PM  

Translate the website from french to english (or other language of course) with babel fish

[Linky]



Jamin7489

Comments: 55
Dec 15 (2005) 08:57PM  

God i love the X30 design if only it had video playback... Kinda looks like the sony Hd5 but with a larger and color screen. If only video why..?



Jamin7489

Comments: 55
Dec 15 (2005) 09:01PM  

Does any one no the demensions of the X30



SowndOfDeth

Comments: 417
Dec 15 (2005) 09:03PM  

@sashimi,
I presume creative thinks that the mac owners would be interested in the ipod only. I am an exception

Songs you buy online would work only through XP.

But if you want to upload non-DRMed mp3s (to Creative and Dell DAPs), this program is useful.
[Linky]



undesign

Comments: 805
Dec 15 (2005) 09:06PM  

So when is Apple going to play catch up and claim to disown the Zen:M ? Will Steve "Spin Doctor" Jobs make useless arguements and have people believe they are true?

In any case, the Zen:M is probably the best mass storage mp3 player today, with more features than you can shake a stick at, its also priced very well. I cant wait to try it out in store to see for my self



SowndOfDeth

Comments: 417
Dec 15 (2005) 09:06PM  

Well that works for most creative daps - the V:M is not on the list of compatible devices - but doesn't mean it might not work. Someone check out and post back.



SowndOfDeth

Comments: 417
Dec 15 (2005) 09:07PM  

that - meaning the program I linked to in my previous post (XNJB)



egloskerry

Comments: 410
Dec 15 (2005) 09:10PM  

It's sad that it's taken this long for companies to catch up in the design department. Props to Toshiba and Creative for their excellent designs.



undesign

Comments: 805
Dec 15 (2005) 09:18PM  

egloskerry: sonys nw-hd1/2/3 were all amazingly designed. slim, thin, and lasted LONG on batteries. this was a while back too.

the iAudio M5/L was amazingly designed too. tho style wise, its kind of subjective.



3284lmm
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Comments: 358
Dec 15 (2005) 09:24PM  

I've found the "+" touchpad a pain the ass to use, maybe I need to warm up to it more ( I only played with it for 5minutes at Bestbuy) I just thought it was hard to remember which buttoms to press when navigating.



Hyper_Noodle

Comments: 226
Dec 15 (2005) 09:35PM  

Whyyyyyyyy do the gigabeats have to taunt with their sexy looks and lack of OGG support???? Whyyyyyyyyyy???



gstom1

Comments: 41
Dec 15 (2005) 09:41PM  

3284lmm, I agree with you. I played with the Gigabeat at several stores and also found the "+" touchpad difficult to use.

It's been a long time coming, but Creative Labs has finally come up with a winner in the Zen Vision: M. A great combination, of size, looks and features. I'll be on it as soon as they release a 60GB (or greater) version.





RandomFish

Comments: 42
Dec 15 (2005) 10:25PM  

Jamin7489,
Width 59.3 x height 14.5 x depth 99.3mm



608zz
Location: DC metro area.
Comments: 270
Dec 15 (2005) 11:42PM  

Best mass storage device is the universal kind, and neither of these devices are that. UMS means you can connect it to any computer regardless of OS and it’ll show up as an external HD.



LiQuiD_FuSioN

Comments: 117
Dec 16 (2005) 01:10AM  

The gigabeat looks fugly, but I like the Zen.



Michael
Location: New York City
Comments: 2802
Dec 16 (2005) 02:10AM  

How could you think it looks ugly? It looks sooo sweet



Keon

Comments: 11
Dec 16 (2005) 04:04AM  

Avoid MTP like the plague!



Dr Doom

Comments: 23
Dec 16 (2005) 04:17AM  

Why Does'nt the X30 have video playback, whats up with that? Anyway it looks hawt!



ilh

Comments: 168
Dec 16 (2005) 05:47AM  

3284lmm and gstom1. How could you forget which buttons to press? It's right to get to the next level in the menu, left to go back, centre to play album/artist/track. Not exactly overloading
After you get used to it, it is the best interface out there imo. The hidden slide techniques are really useful...don't know why they don't illustrate them in the manual.
Slide right to left brings up the current album menu.
bottom to top brings up the main menu.
left to right goes back to the now playing screen.



Allen
Location: Dub Vee Ooo
Comments: 1511
Dec 16 (2005) 06:34AM  

These players COULD both be great.... But its the lack of ogg vorbis, gapless play back, (video playback for the X30), MSC capabilities, and a few other random qualms.... because of these drawbacks,(drawvacks IMO... if you think differntly... good, you should) I will continue to marvel at the vision:m and X30 from afar...



gstom1

Comments: 41
Dec 16 (2005) 06:41AM  

illh, I'll admitt, playing with th1e Gigabeat for 5 minutes at several stores does not provide an accurate indication of usign the player on a day-to-day basis. When I played with the Zen Micro a few times, I thought the slider was way too sensitive and difficult to use. I'm sure if I used these players on a regular basis, I could master the controls pretty easy. The same goes for the A/B buttons found on a lot of iRiver product.




3284lmm
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Comments: 358
Dec 16 (2005) 08:39AM  

Don't get me wrong i'm not saying the Toshiba touchpad design isn't intuitive, I just didn't find it as easy to use as the clickwheel or the configuration on the newer gen zen players. I'm sure if I played with it enought I could use it without having to look at the touchpad. They both look like very solid players.



608zz
Location: DC metro area.
Comments: 270
Dec 16 (2005) 12:02PM  

Support open standards by purchasing only devices that are UMS-compliant, such as the ones made by Cowon, Archos and Samsung. Don’t buy into the Microsoft lockdown known as MTP (which is what Creative and Toshiba devices are).



schmintan

Comments: 3
Dec 16 (2005) 12:30PM  

just wondering, how does the OS on this work, does the screen orientation change, depending on how you hold the DAP, as in the image shown here, its obviously set up for a lefty, but can it be changed to work any way around? also, whats the chance of a firmware update to allow this to play videos?



ilh

Comments: 168
Dec 17 (2005) 06:36AM  

No idea what you mean by "how does the OS on this work".
There's a number of different ways to set it out, all have album art apart from the second 1:

Vertical with some freaky ball thing
Vertical with some speakers
Vertical
Vertical with large album art (1 that I use)
Vertical with large writing
Side right
Side right with large writing
Side left
Side left with large writing

^Those are the F20, there's a couple more on the X30 but I don't know what they are.
Pretty meh chance, I didn't see 1 with the F20 but I think they were just busy working on the X series, so who knows now.



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Lacene
The ZVM is pretty much the most "high-end" DAP I ever got....I got started on DAPs by getting a Dell Pocket DJ, lol. It was a re-branded Creative DAP. All others I got are Sandisk DAPs....

Saijin_Naib
Yeah, I used to remember when I was jealous of Creative DAPs. I couldn't afford to have the "top of the line" DAPs back then, and messed with no-name Chinese OEMs.

These days, you're almost better off taking that route.

Cowon still seems to put out quality. Samsung just makes Android players, same for Archos.

MPIO (my favorite) has become defunct.

These are dark times for DAPs

Lacene
I still have my ZVM that I got when they first came out....it still works and looks like new...I never abused it and put one of those clear protective shields on it and got a silicon case for it.

A shame that Creative put it out - their most highly-regarded DAP ever - and then seemed to go downhill immediately afterwards...

Saijin_Naib
Yeah, I played with one. Pretty slick, great interface. So great in fact, that Apple largely knocked it off and sued Creative to keep the rights. Bastards.

I have a Creative Zen Vision Micro 6gb I need to repair/swap drive out of.

LiQuiD_FuSioN
Anyone have experience with the Creative ZEN Vision:M? Now that was a cool looking player too, never got to try one out though.

Saijin_Naib
Yeah, my friend had the S9 and he really loved it, especially the custom GUIs people would cook up.

I noticed that Cowon recently released a D20 and an X9. They both look rather tempting. Availability looks spotty at the moment though :L

My favorite DAP probably would have been the Zune30, if it was slightly more customizable. The RIO players had great auto-playlisting & searching support.

Similarly, the Haier Ibiza (despite its other shortcomings) has a brilliant filter feature and related features during playback.

It, however, can't make a shuffle list to save its digital life so it gets on my nerves using it as my car player.

Yeah, people still seem to love convergence devices. I'm still of the mind that I'd rather have devices that are designed for a specific task, and execute that task properly. The biggest pet peeve I have is crappy tools, and convergence devices by definition, are crappy tools. By attempting to do everything, they do no single task well.

SarahV
@Saijin: The J3 is one of the best DAPs I've had. The GUI is way better than the S9. The hardware is pretty similar. I still have a special place in my heart for the iRiver Clix, though. Loved the interface on that so much...

The problem we have today is that hardly anyone actually uses a DAP and they don't want to carry more than one device. I probably carry my mp3 player more than my phone, but I realize most people are not like me

Saijin_Naib
This community was tops. I still think we could be.

LiQuiD_FuSioN
Good ol' DAP Review! I still remember when Engadget would rip your stories off.

Saijin_Naib
That sounds like a decent size for a music library. How are you finding the Cowon? They seem to be one of the few manufactures left that makes anything halfway decent. I'm not interested in Yet Another Android Slate (YAAS) like the Archos line have devolved into.

But Sarah, the iProducts are the bestest things ever! Their batteries last like, totally way longer than like, other players do!


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