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ZDNet: "[..] if you own an iPod, it's got CRAP in it [...]"

comment: 45 | Tuesday, March 28 (2006) 09:00AM | Posted by Martinp

ZDNet has a very interesting take on the whole Digital Rights Management deal that is going on at the moment. Instead of calling it DRM though, they call it CRAP, which stands for Content, Restriction, Annulment, and Protection.

David Berlind, the executiver Editor, actually gets really excited about the whole deal. He explains that there are three big companies out there trying to force their proprietary DRM systems on the consumer. Should a consumer however decide to switch from an Apple DAP to Sony DAP he will not be able to play the music he has legally purchased.

That's why he recommends not to buy any products with "CRAP" inside them, because they are restricting your rights as a consumer.

Check out the Video

Comments

Lacene

Location: Standing Here, Confused By Your
Comments: 827

Mar 28 (2006) 09:35AM

Check out the forum:
[Linky]

- where others get excited as well, including myself unfortunately.

I call it Sad, Horrid, Inexcusable Technology.
[ edited Mar 28 (2006) 09:40AM ]

enigman

Comments: 216

Mar 28 (2006) 09:48AM

I'm too lazy to register to download it.

Can anyone upload to anywhere else?

Deano

Comments: 123

Mar 28 (2006) 09:51AM

Well, I wish there were more people around willing to berate DRM (or CRAP as it should be known) in this kind of way.

The other thing is, why do people want to download such substandard stuff? From iTunes you have to suffer 128kbps files... why can't you get ALAC?

Janus based DRM... why can't you get Lossless WMA files except sub quality lossy WMA files.

*sigh* You get no benefit. If you buy a CD, you get the ability to (in theory) rip whatever format you like. People need to learn that CDs are still the win.

Lacene

Location: Standing Here, Confused By Your
Comments: 827

Mar 28 (2006) 10:00AM

enigman says:
I'm too lazy to register to download it.

what do you mean, enigman?? You are registered here: all you have to do is select which video player to view the video with, & it'll play.

at least it does w/me - I didn't register on their site.

syadasti

Comments: 24

Mar 28 (2006) 10:10AM

We already know France and Denmark hate CRAP. Hopefully the whole EU agrees CRAP is crap and we'll get some sort of universal DRM that works on all players and allows consumer's fair use of content they bought.

Lighter

Comments: 102

Mar 28 (2006) 10:16AM

A fellow can never type Cowon too often.

.
[ edited Mar 28 (2006) 03:18PM ]

koppite1

Comments: 248

Mar 28 (2006) 10:20AM

I still buy CDs. I refuse to download until they stop making CDs in fact, as I refuse to have crap thrust on me

Piggen

Comments: 58

Mar 28 (2006) 10:58AM

Strange. ZDnet is a part of Cnet, but Cnet loves DRM.

Martinp

Comments: 299

Mar 28 (2006) 11:28AM

Sorry about that ... *blush*

I copied some html code from another post of mine. Cowon is such an integral part of me that I don't even notice if I put in sentences randomly. That's cowon really werid - isn't cowon it?

3284lmm

Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Comments: 358

Mar 28 (2006) 11:38AM

[Linky]

check out my thread in the forums.

enigman

Comments: 216

Mar 28 (2006) 11:50AM

what do you mean, enigman?? You are registered here: all you have to do is select which video player to view the video with, & it'll play.

at least it does w/me - I didn't register on their site.

Oh, my bad.

I didn't check it clearly and though that links to player programs were the link to load the video.

I got the video now.

Cassiopeia

Comments: 188

Mar 28 (2006) 11:58AM

I compeletly agree with this guy.

DRM sux, if you can't play it anywhere you want.

at least Janus works in hundreds of daps, but Apple, and Sony ones are too C.R.A.P.PY

undesign

Comments: 786

Mar 28 (2006) 12:00PM

Zip22 should take notes from this guy.

zip22

Comments: 1809

Mar 28 (2006) 12:31PM

i agree with him completely. drm is crap, and we should stick to buying cds. i also said that in the forum, but you aparently can't be troubled by reading something.

koppite1

Comments: 248

Mar 28 (2006) 12:36PM

undesign and zipp22, do I detect hostility between you two?

Ah, come on. Show the love...why hate?

bob2300NX

Comments: 42

Mar 28 (2006) 12:50PM

UNDESIGN: Zip22 should take notes from this guy.

ZIP22: i agree with him completely. drm is crap, and we should stick to buying cds. i also said that in the forum, but you aparently can't be troubled by reading something.

Lets just get these two to stop bickering and give them boxing gloves. I place my bet on undesign, just because it seems like he is maybe alittle nuts in the head.

[ edited Mar 28 (2006) 12:51PM ]

musicman

Comments: 336

Mar 28 (2006) 12:51PM

It's misleading when saying;
"That's why he recommends not to buy any products with "CRAP" inside them, because they are restricting your rights as a consumer."
All of those players will also play unprotected audio formats, just like the players that don't support a form of DRM. If you don't want to be restricted to which player you may purchase in the future, you can buy these models, just don't buy any music from their respective stores.

zip22

Comments: 1809

Mar 28 (2006) 12:55PM

i agree, hes confusing the issue.

dapreview editors have a way of capturing the goofiest video stills.

pablo

Comments: 11

Mar 28 (2006) 02:06PM

What I don't completely understand is why are there competing formats in the first place. I assume the media companies have some control over what DRM scheme their distributors implement and that it would be in their best interests to push for one. Basically, if MS or Apple don't like it, then no music for you.

[Sony, who has their hands in everything, is an exception. As creating their own DRM may make business sense since they own music and hardware.]

If there is a single form of digital copyrighting, then people may be less inclined to bitch, moan and pirate and it would probably increase digital sales.

I too hate DRM, but having incompatible formats makes little sense from the media owner's business perspective. Am I missing something?

Lacene

Location: Standing Here, Confused By Your
Comments: 827

Mar 28 (2006) 02:30PM

pablo, as I mentioned in the forum, the fact that microsoft & apple is involved is entirely the reason we are having this C.R.A.P./S.H.I.T. Sure, the music industry is directing the fact that there is DRM in some format or another, but they wouldn't care if it's DRM-wma or DRM-aac, as long as it's DRM. MS & apple, on the other hand, would sue to the end of eternity if the MI tried to make them conform to each other's formats, or to a general format: they've already invested to much of their companies in thier proprietary formats. Sony, IMO, is possibly even worse than MS & A with their atrac, as many of their earlier players didn't even support mp3 format.

DRM in any format is CRAP, here's an example: I purchased 30 songs from Napster on my work PC. I then get a PC for my home: you're supposed to be able to D-L your music to 3 PC's, so I D-L'd my music - no problem, even the license back-up folder D-L'd. But for some reason, my napster music would'nt play. There's no instructions in the help, or the on-line FAQ's, I had to e-mail them. 2 days later, they responded, & told me how to update my licenses.

If I use to take my LP, or my cassette, off of a sanyo or pioneer player, & put it on a sony or panasonic player, I wouldn't have to wait 2 days - it would play!!

DRM punishes the 90% of the consumer base for the actions of 10% who steal music, or copy & sell it for $$.

undesign

Comments: 786

Mar 28 (2006) 02:36PM

If DRM wasnt standardized (one format for all devices, or all devices allowing all formats with DRM) we wouldnt have this problem.

My hat goes off to the French as well as the Danish for taking down DRM. But id also like to give the US Gov. a big FUCK YOU for backing up apple as if its the only company being targeted.

udauda

Location: the Golden State California
Comments: 61

Mar 28 (2006) 03:05PM

@undesign: lol Ill second that FU

derwersei

Comments: 15

Mar 28 (2006) 04:46PM

i can't watch it.. firefox just reloads the page, opera is friendly enough to say 404

zip22

Comments: 1809

Mar 28 (2006) 04:48PM

can you read the transcript?
[Linky]

derwersei

Comments: 15

Mar 28 (2006) 04:58PM

nvm, using an "untouched" user profile in firefox fixed it for me.
thanks anyway

Allen

Location: Dub Vee Ooo
Comments: 1511

Mar 28 (2006) 05:45PM

Okay... I disagree with him... you can buy the players that SUPPORT crap, but dont buy the crap, like the music subscriptions and purchasing single tracks and cds off the internet... A few of us still remember what CD's are....

AFD

Location: Northeastern, U.S.
Comments: 166

Mar 28 (2006) 06:10PM

"People need to learn that CDs are still the win."

Other than the DRM-infected CD variants, I agree 100%. I can't believe that people continue purchasing music online. Other than the DRM, the overall quality of these tracks seems very poor. CRAP = Consumer Raping Audio Protection =)

Fixxxer

Comments: 36

Mar 28 (2006) 07:41PM

I agree with Deano, CDs are still the best way. I mean sure, i download music, but i still do it illegally, so there is no crap anywhere, and my Gmini400 doesn't deal with this crap. I am all about supporting artists, but FUCK the RIAA and DRM's and all that shit.

Go ZDNet by the way, that took some balls

Donnie

Comments: 247

Mar 29 (2006) 07:13AM

Yes, the perk of buying a CD is the lack of CRAP and something tangible with the money spent. Good thing we're not forced to buy one particular dap, yech.

undesign

Comments: 786

Mar 29 (2006) 10:35AM

Good thing we're not forced to buy one particular dap, yech.

But, but.....thats what the asshole Steve Jobs is trying to do...

Donnie

Comments: 247

Mar 29 (2006) 10:41AM

Yep, that and forcing the owners (that don't use Rockbox) to go through iTunes to manage files.

Damn that Steve Jobs and that white earbud fad that won't go away.

dasmenneke

Comments: 135

Mar 29 (2006) 11:26AM

The problem with cd's is that you can't have a "custom" cd i.e. songs from different artists that you choose on one cd.

AND cd's are to expensive if I just want 5 particular songs from an album

pablo

Comments: 11

Mar 29 (2006) 11:56AM

yeah, CDs are a good fallback, but in the near future I don't see music CDs being available....there is no need to produce/distribute physical media (esp. as I assume the margins are significantly lower than digital downloads). It might take 10 years (I suspect less), but it will happen.

DRM is here to stay....one can only hope they work out cross-platform issues.

Deano

Comments: 123

Mar 29 (2006) 01:18PM

You don't necessarily need iTunes to manage an iPod. There are third party alternatives available to it. ephPod, for example, to transfer your music. You could use a combination of EAC and FAAC to encode your .m4a files...

Just people don't realise it.

Digitalbath83

Comments: 87

Mar 29 (2006) 04:40PM

lol deano they realize it, they just don't want to admit it :p.

Anyway you will never catch me using CRAP. I buy used cds (none of that money goes to the RIAA) for $6.99-$9.99. I rip to FLAC and Lame. Put them on my nano and on my Cowon A2 and then I go about my merry way.

I don't understand why people buy low quality drm music. I know I'll never be that dumb

[ edited Mar 29 (2006) 04:44PM ]

undesign

Comments: 786

Mar 29 (2006) 11:11PM

99 cents per song? Apples takes how much of the cut? 35% for doing NOTHING? What idiot would actually still use a shit service like that knowing its faults and knowing what the competition has to offer.

Worst, service, ever (itunes).

zip22

Comments: 1809

Mar 29 (2006) 11:34PM

where did you pull that number from? according to the register, apple makes next to nothing.
[Linky]

and apple does the marketing, the software development, the bandwidth, the server management, and i'm guessing the encoding. that stuff isn't free.

undesign

Comments: 786

Mar 30 (2006) 12:26AM

zip: STFU. i wasnt talking about profits, they take 35% of the 99 cents: [Linky]

they market their ipod along with itunes, they dont market their itunes alone. software wise, again: STFU. you know nothing about the mac platform. iTunes itself is running off quicktime and is an integral part of the complete OS, theres no extra dedicated cash spent on "itunes music store" exclusively, its part of apple. bandwidth wise, i wouldnt worry about that for apple. encoding choons isnt a heavy weight task either.

Honestly, why do you praise apple so much eventhough you know jackshit about its products, aside from the ipod which you dont even own?

zip22

Comments: 1809

Mar 30 (2006) 12:40AM

a) that website is not credible

b) there are numerous itunes only advertising campaigns

c) itunes and the itunes music store both require software engineers. do you think this stuff just pops out of osx?

d) apple gets free bandwidth from somewhere? thats pretty cool.

you have no idea what the hell you are talking about and you have no information whatsoever to base your arguments off of.

edit: if you read one of that website's sources, its an article about how great itunes pricing is
[Linky]

[ edited Mar 30 (2006) 12:52AM ]

undesign

Comments: 786

Mar 30 (2006) 12:49AM

a) your wikipedia websites are NEVER credible. and the last source you linked had NO mention of the exact cut apple takes from each song. and your an idiot for saying its not credible because you dont like getting put in place.

b) considering OS X is shipped with itunes which is always updates with new releases/updated copys of OS X, YES. Its a part of quicktime which quicktime is always updated, any change to quicktime gets a change for itunes (audio wise, well now video too). R&D for itunes is NOT an "extra cost" for apple, its always been there.

c) yeah, bandwidth for APPLE is really a major expense....ffs, think about it you idiot.

You have no idea what the hell you are talking about, you dont own a mac, you dont know how a mac works, you dont even know what parts apple makes for macs (hint; NONE!) and you certainly dont know much about OS X.

Get out, noone should be reading the ignorant comments you make.

zip22

Comments: 1809

Mar 30 (2006) 12:53AM

so basically your argument is apple gets free bandwidth for the millions of songs and videos downloaded. they also get free servers. they don't spend any money developing software at all and they don't market it either. is that the gist of it?
[ edited Mar 30 (2006) 12:55AM ]

undesign

Comments: 786

Mar 30 (2006) 12:59AM

zip, read the reply again you moron, or, read again below:
OS X which has always included itunes, is already an expense, itunes is not a "new expense"

Apple doesnt pay much for bandwidth, i can GUARANTEE YOU THAT.

and lastly, dont make up arguements i never made mention of (marketing) but tell me, when has apple ever advertised its music store on its own? or in part with something?

Zip22 is ignorant.

zip22

Comments: 1809

Mar 30 (2006) 01:09AM

so the osx version of itunes runs on windows? thats interesting. and itunes had all the music store support built in when it first came out? it didn't need to be designed?

undesign wrote ...
they dont market their itunes alone.

you said that.
itunes advertising... lets see itunes+pepsi promotions? those were huge.
internet ads?
[Linky]

[ edited Mar 30 (2006) 01:14AM ]

Lacene

Location: Standing Here, Confused By Your
Comments: 827

Mar 30 (2006) 01:37AM

Honestly, why do you praise apple so much eventhough you know jackshit about its products, aside from the ipod which you dont even own?

zip, is that true?? I understand you own, or had owned, several iPods in the past?

zip22

Comments: 1809

Mar 30 (2006) 01:45AM

i sold a 2G, and currently own the shuffle.

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